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T H O M A S   M C  C A R T H Y, having been produced as a witness for and in behalf of the people, and having first been duly sworn, testified as follows:

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. LILLIE.

Q

Whereabouts do you live?

A

About a half a mile west of Denison

Q

How long have you lived there?

A

All my life.

Q

You knew Martin Golden of course in his life time?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

What relation was he if anything to you?

A

No relation.

Q

Do you remember the night of his murder?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Where were you that evening?

A

I was at the store until twenty minutes after eight.

Q

About what time did you get to the store?

A

About a quarter to eight I should think.

Q

Who was with you?

A

Why Ed McCarthy was there, at the time I was in there George Carr, Jake Knipe, Mike Malone, Bristol Wilton.

Q

How long did you say you stayed in the store?

A

I think I stayed there better than a half an hour a little, not much.

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Q

And how many of those parties were still in the store when you went away?

A

Jake Knipe and George Carr.

Q

Were there when you went out?

A

Were there when I went out.

Q

Who went out with you?

A

Ed McCarthy.

Q

Which way did you go from the store when you went out?

A

West.

Q

How far?

A

Well I should think about thirty rods, I don’t think it is, it might be twenty-five rods from the store.

Q

Where did you stop in reference to any particular party’s house?

A

My uncle’s house.

Q

That is also Thomas McCarthy?

A

Yes, sir, stopped there at the milk stand.

Q

And the milk stand was in the road?

A

Yes, sir, by the side of the wagon track.

Q

In the highway?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Was there anybody there with you and Ed?

A

No, sir.

Q

While you were standing there did you see anybody leave the store or go by you?

A

Yes, sir, Homer Hanchett went past us while we were standing there with a lantern.

Q

Homer had a lantern, did he?

A

Yes, sir.

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Q

A lighted lantern?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Did he go both ways, towards the store and back?

A

No he came from the south, from the middle road to the store.  He was not there when we were there. Then he went over to Mr. Kooney’s place from the store.

Q

Mr. Kooney lives just north of where you and Ed were, doesn’t he?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Is Mr. Kooney any relation to Homer?

A

His father-in-law.

Q

About how far north from where you and Ed stood or sat is Mr. Kooney’s house?

A

Oh I should think fifteen rods.

Q

Whether or not that is north of the D & M track and also the interurban track?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Were you standing on what is called the state road?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Whether or not that crosses the D & M track and the interurban track west of where you stood?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

About how far west?

A

Well it is about, I should think about four rods from where we were standing across the D & M tracks.

Q

And then the interurban is just north of that?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

Now you know where Tom McCarthy’s barns are down on the state road west of there do you not?

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A

Yes, sir.

Q

About how far would you say that was from where you and Ed were?

A

I should think it would be about sixty rods, I never noticed it much either, as often as I have walked there, but I would think it was about that.

Q

That is all level ground there, isn’t it?

A

Yes, sir.

Q

And have you at any time measured the distance between where you and Ed stood and the store?

A

No, sir.

Q

About how long did you and Ed stay there at the milk stand before you heard anything peculiar?

A

Why I should think about twenty minutes.

Q

What was that that you heard, just state what you heard.

A

Why in the first place we heard, I heard some racket just as though somebody stepped on the end of a board on the walk.  Those boards are loose and as he stepped off from it it dropped down again, that is all the sound that we heard then and I could not tell exactly what direction it was because our backs were turned but it sounded just like that.

Q

And then what was the next?

A

Well then I heard a fellow holler “here, here” and I heard a shot fired, and I turned very near half way around so that I could see the fire, the light out of the revolver, the second shot.

Q

Were those two shots pretty close together?

A

Yes, sir, I should think about as quick as he could pull it.

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Q

And then what was the next that you heard?

A

Well the next I heard was something coming down the road, I didn’t know what it was until it got so that we could distinguish the figure.

Q

Now you say you heard something coming down the road, now what did it appear as?

A

Why I thought it was a horse trotting on a hard path there in the first, I told my cousin, that there comes a horse trotting.

Q

And as it came closer to you what did you determine it was?

A

Why I heard some heavy breathing, we heard the breathing before we could distinguish whether it was a horse or a man.

Q

What do you mean by heavy breathing - - kind of wheeze like?

A

Well no, not exactly a wheeze.

          MR. TURNER:  Like a steam whistle.

Q

Go on.  You are testifying not Turner.

A

It was heavy thick breathing, something more like that I should think, (witness demonstrating), is the way I heard it.

Q

And how long did you hear that before you observed anybody?

A

Why it might be a minute or two, I don’t think it was any longer than that.

Q

Did you see anybody?

A

Yes, sir, I saw the figure of a man.

Q

About how far was that man from you when he passed by you?

A

Well it was just fifteen feet when it passed by us.

Q

And how far could you distinguish the man before he passed by you that night?

A

Oh it must be five or six rods I should think.

Q

That is five or six rods that you could distinguish it was a man?